Security deposit question

Posted by Shamus (492 days ago)

I would like some advice on using my 2 month security deposit as the last 2 months rent.
I know this question has been asked many times on this forum, however I coudn't find much when I searched for suggestions.

Rental tenancy agreement expires July 18th 2007. I would like to use the deposit in lieu of paying my last 2 months rent. Flat is in same condition as when I moved in (ie... No damage)

If I thought I would have no problems or hassles getting the deposit back then I would have no hesitations in paying the last 2 months rent. However, I am leaving HK permanently on the 14th of July (the day after my employment contract expires) and I don't have a lot of time to play the usual games with my landlord. I have lived in HK for 5 years and resided in several different places within that time. In my experience, it was never straight forward in getting the security deposit back promptly (ss I have always paid the last 2 months rent)

My landlord is elderly and has refused to pay for anything since I moved in, and I just envision a lot of stress and hassle when it comes time to leave, as I have enough to deal with as it is.

I think that I will definitely loose the deposit if I do not get it before I leave HK (ie, deposit it into my account or some rubbish like that). The problem is that I will have a very short window of opportunity from when I vacate the flat to when I get on the airplane.

I will politely ask the landlord if this is acceptable after I pay for May's rent, however I don't think that he'll go for it. Can I just do it anyway? Change the lock and hope for the best? Invite him over to inspect the flat?

I am not trying to cause problems just trying to avoid what I know will happen if I leave it to chance that I will get my deposit back.

Thanks for any suggestions.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

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Posted by Pepperoni Wong (492 days ago)

Why change the locks ? Your landlord has NO right to enter the premises while you are in residence, not even if you are late with your rent. If he enters without your explicit permission, he is trespassing, and that is an offence under the law.
My advice: when the time comes to pay the second last monthly rental, simply inform him that you will not pay any more rent till your departure. No need to argue, no need to explain. If he comes over to your place and starts knocking on the door, tell him to buzz off or you will call the police. If he threatens to sue you, just ignore the old fool. By the time the case is due you will be long gone, and the legal costs alone will deter your landlord. And he KNOWS it.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by Shamus (492 days ago)

Thanks, I thought about changing the locks as I read (while looking for answers on this forum) that the landlord can enter your premises and cease all of your property for auction if you are over 10 days late with your rent???

It all seems a bit risky and I don't want to cause trouble but I also don'[t want to lose out on 2 months rent that I should get back. I would like to believe that I could pay him his last 2 months and we would agree to meet at the flat a few days before I leave to exchange keys and return my deposit but I think I would be foolish and end up losing in the end. As my past experiences have taught me.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by mhabitat (492 days ago)

Shamus, don't pay the last two month's of rent. Inform your landlord about your intention. Tell her she can come to your flat to inspect any damages before you leave, and that if she finds any damages, you'll be willing to compensate her on the spot.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by briandwest (492 days ago)

Don't pay the rent.
Don't inform the landlord - if he chases you asking where the rent is do the HK thing "Oh, so sorry, I forgot to pay, I'll do it in the next few days."
Don't tell the landlord that you are leaving HK - it will only get him interested in extracting rent before you leave.
If he asks if you want to extend give a positive non-commital answer e.g. "I certainly want to as I like living here."
Change the locks for piece of mind - It'll only cost $100 including fitting and ensures the landlord has no access (legal or not).

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by Jalous Uranus (492 days ago)

The minute I take the keys for a new flat, I change the locks immediately. Who knows who else has the keys.

The landlord has absolutely no right to enter your flat. It's also known as "quiet enjoyment". The only way he can get in, is by an order of the court - something that will take time to get.

The security deposit is a deposit for any damage caused to the flat other than fair wear and tear. Your lease will state when the security deposit is refundable by the landlord. Usually, when you hand the keys back, the landlord will come along to view the flat. Right then and there, both of you will come to a settlement, or agreement for full refund.

If you want to use the deposit against rental payment, I'm sure the landlord will kick up a fuss, but given the time frame, probably little will be done.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by Shamus (491 days ago)

Thanks everyone for your replies. Has anyone ever had any bad experiences in trying to use the deposit as the last 2 months rent?

Obviously I know the reasoning behind the security deposit, but as I said from experience the landlord never just hands it over on the spot... It has always taken awhile to get back (countless phone calls, setting up meeting times, no-shows, not answering the phone, even a threat of legal action, etc) Moreover, if my current landlord was to know that I was leaving HK permanently a few days after I vacate the flat, I believe my chances would be slim to nil of recovering my deposit.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by Meiguoren (491 days ago)

I agree with all that briandwest has said. Why alert the LL to anything? Why NOT change the locks, who cares whether LL has a "right" to enter or not, since if he were to do it there could be problems? I believe in being fair, but experience shows that LL's often -- usually -- do not believe in being fair. A LL recently hit one of my friends up for 40K HKD in "damages" for an apartment that looked to me as if the only "damage" was completely normal wear and tear (e.g. paint was no longer fresh, pictures had been taken off walls, etc). As a practical matter, power is in the hands of he who holds the $$.

(I am based in Guangzhou)

Posted by Shamus (462 days ago)

Update:

After a lot of thought, My wife and I decided to inform our landlord that we would not pay our last 2 months rent and He could keep the rental deposit in lieu of payment. We would of course settle all bills and hand over the keys 4 days before our lease technically expires. Also he would be invited over to have a look at the flat to see for himself that we have not damaged anything. However, as expected he did not go for it and demanded that we pay our last to months rent according to the law.

My question is what recourse does he have if I simply don't pay it... I am leaving HK permanently a few days after I vacate the flat and don't have time to play the usual games involved in getting a deposit back (ie, never has been easy for me always involved a lot of headaches and trouble.)

I think that if we do pay, what can I do to ensure that I'll get it back? Sign an agreement? I think it's worthless as what can be done on such short notice if He decides to take his time in paying us. It will be easy for him to ignore us for a week before we leave permanently. A promise to give it back a week before we leave isn't very comforting as untimately he will have the money and we will have only his word ( which in my experiences doesn't account for much in HK, sorry to say, especially when money is involed!!)

I would pay in a heart beat if I thought I would give it back as agreed upon. I am not trying to hide from my obligations, simply don't want to place myself in a situation which I'm surely to be the one who loses out in the end.

I really thought about simply not even informing the landlord but then wondered how I could do this for 2 months??

If I don't pay, what can he do?

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by ldavy (462 days ago)

He can take you to Court. If the sum involved is under 50K he can take you to the Small Claims Tribunal, and if it's more than that he can go to the District Court. I have no idea how long this would take though, and it may well be that you'll be out of Hong Kong before he gets a Court date.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by beancurd (461 days ago)

Last year we are suppose to leave Hk and we gave one month notice to our nice Landlady and she informed us she cannot return the deposit but we can use that deposit for 2 months. She only informed us verbally that she has to check our house if any damage and we have to compensate. As simple as that. But fortunately, we are still in Hong Kong with the same house and the Landlady was happy that we stayed.

(I am based in Hong Kong)